The only solution in Palestine is for Israel to move to America

    Recently, an American tried to convince me online that HAMAS is not a terrorist organization. Maybe I should have fainted? Yesterday, he told me that Hamas is fighting for liberation, not for Islam. Maybe I should have fainted again?

    Quoting me from yesterday's post, he wrote - emphasis added by me.

Julio 

"I see no way the religious war in Palestine will ever resolve as long as the state of Israel exists." 

The state of Israel surely can have the right to exist, but a sane Israel that conforms to the international rules of human rights. I do wish and believe that that country can silence or expulse their fanatic theocracy and will return to the not long-ago ways where in the "Holy Land" normal members of the three Abrahamic religions lived peacefully. Here in America, we also have to commit to stop the Christian right which is increasingly making our country a theocracy too. Hamas is fighting for liberation, not for Islam. The problem is and has always been fundamentalist religion. 

Sloan Bashinsky

HAMAS is an acronym. Look it up.

HAMAS–the acronym for Harakat al-Muqawama al-Islamiya (Islamic Resistance Movement)—is the largest and most capable militant group in the Palestinian territories and one of the territories' two major political parties. 

https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/what-hamas

Excerpts:

Hamas, an acronym for Harakat al-Muqawama al-Islamiya (“Islamic Resistance Movement”), was founded by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, a Palestinian cleric who became an activist in local branches of the Muslim Brotherhood after dedicating his early life to Islamic scholarship in Cairo. Beginning in the late 1960s, Yassin preached and performed charitable work in the West Bank and Gaza, both of which Israel occupied following the 1967 Six-Day War.

Yassin established Hamas as the Brotherhood’s political arm in Gaza in December 1987, following the outbreak of the first intifada, a Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation of the West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem. At the time, Hamas’s purpose was to counter Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), another organization whose commitment to violently resisting Israel threatened to draw Palestinians’ support away from the Brotherhood. In 1988, Hamas published its charter, calling for the destruction of Israel and the establishment of an Islamic society in historic Palestine. In what observers called an attempt to moderate its image, Hamas presented a new document [PDF] in 2017 that accepted an interim Palestinian state along the “Green Line” border established before the Six-Day War but that still refused to recognize Israel.

Sloan Bashinsky

I think this is what Israel bases its right to exist in Palestine. Good luck getting religious fanatics on either side to get along and live and let live. 

Old Testament 

Amos 9 

I saw the Lord standing by the altar, and he said:

“Strike the tops of the pillars

so that the thresholds shake.

Bring them down on the heads of all the people;

those who are left I will kill with the sword.

Not one will get away,

none will escape.

2 Though they dig down to the depths below,

from there my hand will take them.

Though they climb up to the heavens above,

from there I will bring them down.

3 Though they hide themselves on the top of Carmel

there I will hunt them down and seize them.

Though they hide from my eyes at the bottom of the sea,

there I will command the serpent to bite them.

4 Though they are driven into exile by their enemies,

there I will command the sword to slay them.

“I will keep my eye on them

for harm and not for good.”

5 The Lord, the Lord Almighty—

he touches the earth and it melts,

and all who live in it mourn;

the whole land rises like the Nile,

then sinks like the river of Egypt;

6 he builds his lofty palace[a] in the heavens

and sets its foundation[b] on the earth;

he calls for the waters of the sea

and pours them out over the face of the land—

the Lord is his name.

7 “Are not you Israelites

the same to me as the Cushites[c]?”

declares the Lord.

“Did I not bring Israel up from Egypt,

the Philistines from Caphtor[d]

and the Arameans from Kir?

8 “Surely the eyes of the Sovereign Lord

are on the sinful kingdom.

I will destroy it

from the face of the earth.

Yet I will not totally destroy

the descendants of Jacob,”

declares the Lord.

9 “For I will give the command,

and I will shake the people of Israel

among all the nations

as grain is shaken in a sieve,

and not a pebble will reach the ground.

10 All the sinners among my people

will die by the sword,

all those who say,

‘Disaster will not overtake or meet us.’

Israel’s Restoration

11 “In that day

“I will restore David’s fallen shelter—

I will repair its broken walls

and restore its ruins—

and will rebuild it as it used to be,

12 so that they may possess the remnant of Edom

and all the nations that bear my name,[e]”

declares the Lord, who will do these things.

13 “The days are coming,” declares the Lord, 

Julio

True, but the West Bank recognized Israel and chose not to fight and yet they have suffered torture from the Israelis. Until the Palestinians are given their lands the Israelis occupied in 1967 there cannot be peace.

Sloan Bashinsky

There cannot be peace in that region as long as the state of Israel exists there and Islam exists there. You erase your credibility by arguing HAMAS is not an Islamic terrorist organization. That's exactly what it is. On October 7 of this year, which was my birthday, Hamas launched a terrorist attack inside Israel, to bait Israel to do precisely what it now is doing. Hamas knew a lot of Palestinian civilians would die. Hamas didn't and doesn't give a shit about Palestinian civilians being killed. Taking the Hamas side or the Israel side is insane. America should have abandoned Israel a long time ago, but that would have wreaked havoc at the polls for members of Congress or a president, who did it. The American Bible thumpers would have voted them out of office, and maybe worse than that. America needs to offer Israel sanctuary in America. Israel probably will decline. America then cuts Israel loose. That's what I would ask Congress to do, if I were president. 

 

Julio

I believe you are forgetting that when Islam was the ruler of Palestine most of the time the three religions lived in peace with the exceptions when the Christian zealots arrived with the crusades, or when the mad Fatimid caliph of Cairo who, believed himself to be God, started persecuting Christians and Jews in the Levant, and now when those crazy Kahanist Jews took control of the region. When Europe expulsed the Jews, the Islamic states received them. Don't forget the Great Maimonides found refuge in Cairo where he became the physician of Saladin after whose death, he remained a physician to the Ayyubid dynasty. Again, the problem is the religious fundamentalists of the world, take them out and stop help from America and you will keep a sane and just Israel for everybody. HAMAS like any liberation movement that faces a much powerful opponent has to resort to terrorism. It happened in Vietnam and everywhere else. I imagine the Brits labeled George Washington a terrorist. It all depends on the point of view, but no one can deny the aftermath of October 7th. helped the world to understand the brutality of the Israeli regime. And for me that is a great success in the advancing of the Palestinian independence. I don't have contacts with celestial beings so I will leave to the more fortunate ones to ask them why the Almighty God permitted or sanctioned the holocaust of the Jews and the Palestinians. You have your well-funded opinions and I have mine and not being a missionary or preacher let's leave it this way. It was good to talk to you.

Sloan Bashinsky

"Again, the problem is the religious fundamentalists of the world, take them out and stop help from America and you will keep a sane and just Israel for everybody."
I don't see any of that happening. 

I think I told you this before, that a few days after 9/11, Archangel Michael told me as I walked out of a U.S. Post Office, that America should get out the the Middle East altogether and let Israel and Islam work it out or fight in out, and in that way learn, which, if either, is God's chosen people. 

Are HAMAS and its benefactor Iran and radical Islam generally so blinded by zealotry that they do not believe Israel will use its nukes if it feels sufficiently threatened? I don't think President Biden understands that, nor the American right, but I think Vladimir Putin does.
Godspeed, Julio 

sloanbashinsky@yahoo.com